35% of Mormons see empathy as a danger that can lead society away from God." https://religionnews.com/2026/10/20/an-empathy-gap-divides-americans-ahead-of-the-midterms-say-prri-report/

I was having breakfast at the bar of the local cafe. I struck up a conversation with the lady next to me. Just polite banter. As her husband is paying the check she says, "If you're looking for a church..." And slides a little coaster toward me and starts her sales pitch. I said, "My church days are years behind me and I don't miss them. "Well it's all about Jesus and we're all sinners." Then her husband comes in. "And I'm the pastor and that includes me."

It's not just Mormons that don't realize how stupid they sound.

We left about 8 years ago. My son graduated high school back in May. Many of his friends and cousins are all leaving on missions. Separating families, exporting their white saviorism to replace other cultures. Claiming they have some magical truth all people are required to adopt. The arrogance. The ego. The narcissism in the missionary program. I hate it! Fuck missions!

But most of all, I hate that the friendships my son built are interrupted at such a lovely time of life. Your late teens and early twenties. Friends need each other. The church chooses this age on purpose. It’s abusive. It’s coercive. It’s controlling. Isolation creates codependency on the institution. Separating kids from their families, friends, to claim they have the truth yet it’s so obviously built on a foundation of lies and deceit! Fuck missions!

I left on my mission in 2000. My best friend left a year later. So we didn’t see each other for 3 years. Couldn’t talk. Only wrote. Life moved on. I was married by the time he got home (again, church) and we have since only been distant friends our entire adult lives. Our missions robbed us of that young adult stage. The fun. The joy. The freedom to figure it out. It replaced it with obedience, control, shame. Fuck missions!

OK, I’m done.

I’ve been out now for about 8 years, and it’s taken me (42F) almost as long to be okay with my body. My current husband, who I’ve been married to for 3.5 years, tells me all the time that I am attractive and beautiful just the way I am. He is the most wonderful human, and has helped me come a LONG way in my confidence. I obviously grew up with the stigma that I am responsible for men’s impure thoughts, and so I must always be modest and not act or dress in any way that could cause a man’s thoughts to stray. Even after I’d been out of the MFMC for years, I struggled with dressing the way I wanted to because of how that concept was pounded into me.

Only in the past 6 months or so have I finally had the courage and confidence to dress how I really want to, to feel comfortable and feel beautiful for myself and my husband. However, I still feel weird around men I know are TBM. I was worried that I was regressing back to my old self, but then I had the disturbing thought - I think Mormon men EXPECT women to take responsibility for their (the men’s) thoughts, and are willing to use it as an excuse to behave however they want.

Has anyone else thought the same thing? Has anyone ever seen this show up? I am just grossed out and feel like I still can’t be myself around the TBM men in my life. (I do feel safe around my dad and brothers).

Just saw this:

Please do not patronize the PCC...the Mormon Church has co-opted the Culture and are profiting from it. They present a Disneyesque version of the culture and whitewash so much of the history. Can't support that at all. This is my opinion and that of the many kanaka I know. Do you realize the way the LDS church got a foothold in Hawaii was by telling the native Hawaiians they were descendants of one of the Lost Tribes of Isreal. It was a vision that one of the missionaries, George Q. Cannon, had in Lahaina. Cannon’s vision was that Polynesians were one of the Lost Tribes of Israel and so Mormon missionaries “had an obligation to return the gospel of Christ,”.

Fresh off their win against Notre Dame and with the highest ranking since 1984, BYU football fans have got to be feeling pretty good right about now. But bad news in the 1000+ calorie cookie market may throw cold water on their high spirits. Crumbl Cookies is closing 57 stores nationally as sales of their (admittedly delicious) half-baked diabetes makers plummet 70%. Now, one might think, "cookies have very little to do with football." And most of the time, they'd be right. But it was the Crumbl owner who convinced BYU football coach Kalani Sitake to stay at BYU instead of moving to a more lucrative coaching position at Penn. And by "convinced" I mean "bought with a massive financial commitment to outbid the Nittany Lions' offer." But with Crumbl in dire financial situation, will its owner have the resources (or desire) to keep that commitment? Or will he decide that his money is better spent keeping his company from going under? And if so, will Sitake start shopping his talents elsewhere after what is looking to be his best season ever, in an echo of Utah's Urban Meyer's abandonment of the Utes?

I have a number of friends and family who are highly educated and extremely intelligent, and who have shown that they can think critically about complicated issues. In fact, some of the smartest and most well-read people I know are active members of the church, one of whom even converted as an adult.

Being both a critical thinker and a faithful member seems like a contradiction. I’ve tried to reconcile the two identities in my head but I’m left unsatisfied. Do I just not understand people well enough?

The idea that these people are just brainwashed feels unsatisfying to me. Slightly more satisfying is the idea that these people just don’t apply the same reasoning to religious matters that they do to work/school/etc.

Does anybody have a way to make sense of this?

This is my attempt to withhold judgment and to build bridges with people in my life who are in the church for reasons I can’t fathom.

Daniel O. McClellan Why I Tithe Because some folks in my audience have reached out in good faith to express concerns and ask for clarification, I thought I’d share a bit about my decision to tithe. I don’t fault anyone for having a negative reaction to learning that I pay tithing to an institution that still harms marginalized, minoritized, and oppressed groups in a variety of ways, and I don’t think it’s a good use of my time to try to talk people out of feelings like that. But for anyone who would be interested in an explanation, there’s actually been quite a lengthy and ongoing wrestle on my part that has gone on behind the scenes of my and my family’s decision to pay tithing. I want to share a bit of that, not because I am trying to convince anyone that my decision is objectively correct, or ethically superior, or that anyone else’s thoughts or feelings on the matter are wrong or invalid or at all a misjudgment, but because I find that I agree with the observations that have recently been made to me in good faith regarding concerns with where people’s support is going and I always want to try to model honest and transparent engagement with the public.

Now, a lot of this is nobody’s business but my family’s, and this is a big reason I’ve never publicly addressed this before. I’ve been happy to be open and honest when people have asked me in person about it in the past, but I haven’t felt like this is something that needed to be publicly addressed, in no small part because I’m not the only one involved in this decision. My family increasingly values our privacy, and we are having to work harder every day to protect it as my channel grows and as—it seems—a small minority of people feel more and more like they have a right to my and my family’s personal and private lives. Having said that, I don’t think it’s out of bounds to expect me to be above board in broad terms about direct financial support of my work funding harmful institutions. Because of that, I want to start by apologizing for not being more cognizant of my responsibility in that regard.

I’ve gotten a number of messages in the past from people who have told me they support my work in principle, but know that to be an active member in good standing almost certainly means I am paying tithing, so they cannot purchase an online class of mine, or they can’t buy my book, or they can’t even contribute to the views my content gets on a specific platform because they will not fund, directly or indirectly, anti-LGBTQIA+ institutions. That’s totally fair and I have never had any complaints about that. I’m well aware of the debates that have been ongoing for years about the ethics of paying tithing to the LDS Church or even remaining a member of any standing, and I know there are thoughtful, insightful, and well-meaning folks on all sides of those debates. I’m certainly not going to fault or argue with anyone who is protecting their own peace or trying to better live up to their own moral intuitions by refusing to financially support the Church, by leaving, or even by advocating for others leaving. There are, no doubt, many other reasons that I’m also not aware of or am just not thinking of at the moment.

I grew up in a family that frequently went through financial struggles and instability, and I can recall a particularly acute period of financial stress after I graduated from high school and was living at home. My mom was a member of the Church at the time, and because of that, our family of seven had access to the Bishop’s Storehouse, meaning I got to know a lot of their food products intimately. I came to know and love their salsa and their granola cereal, and to tolerate or hate most of the rest of the stuff my mom would bring home. But when the need was there, the Church fed our struggling family. Tithing is one of the two main sources of funding for that program. I am not paying tithing because I think I need to pay the Church back, of course, but I have known many individuals and families over the years who—like my own family—have been able to keep adequate food on their tables because of the Bishop’s Storehouse, including members of marginalized and vulnerable groups, and I think that is a valuable program that merits support.

Also, for almost exactly ten years, I worked full-time as a scripture translation supervisor for the LDS Church, which was a job that sent me all over the world to supervise, to train, to employ, and to fellowship translators and reviewers responsible for translation projects in many different languages. I was well aware of and quite critical of the cultural imperialism that is so common to scripture translation and missionary work, much to the chagrin of some of my colleagues, but in addition to many other efforts, I made sure we had a copy of Lamin Sanneh’s Translating the Message in our translation library and quoted from it regularly in trainings and at headquarters. Other colleagues shared many of my concerns and also went out of their way to advocate for change and improvement to the degree they were able within the scope of their influence. I saw where and to whom the tithing dollars I had stewardship over went. I sat around those folks’ kitchen tables or dirt floors in far-flung parts of the world late into the night and got to know them and their communities and the things the Church was doing that influenced them for good and for bad on the local, national, and global level. I have been surprised how many initiatives the Church is involved in in developing nations around the world. Then I came back home and did what I could to advocate for improvements to a wide variety of the programs funded by tithing and by other donations that operate all over the world. I couldn’t change much as one person, but others are still carrying that torch, and I still keep in touch with some of those folks I worked with around the world as well as at Church headquarters. I traveled to dozens of countries as a part of that job and recruited or hired hundreds of people to help us with our projects, and one of the reasons I tithe is because I shook the hands of, looked into the eyes of, and shared meals with so many of the people to whom many of those dollars go, and I want to contribute to helping them to continue to thrive.

That job allowed me to move my small family out of my in-laws’ house and into a home we had built for us over a decade ago that we still live in today. In addition to giving my family a home, those tithing dollars also funded my PhD (through a couple different channels). I know a number of people who are trying to do the same thing right now for themselves and their families in part-time, in contingent, and in full-time jobs for the Church all around the world, and I tithe in part because I want them to succeed the same way that job helped me and my family succeed.

This doesn’t remotely mean I am blind or in any way indifferent to the harm that the Church has done and continues to do with those dollars, and I have spoken out against that repeatedly and consistently in public and private for over 20 years now, including during my two campaigns for the Utah state legislature as a Democrat in my deep red corner of Salt Lake County in 2018 and 2020 (while I was employed by the Church and even teaching an adjunct religion class at BYU). I particularly abhor the more recent contributions and messaging the Church has made to oppose a citizen-led ballot measure aimed at legislating reproductive freedom in Idaho. The Church is far from a perfect institution, and I hope the work that many people around the world are doing to influence the Church from the inside and the outside toward minimizing harm and maximizing access to power and resources for vulnerable and underprivileged groups becomes more successful, whether or not I am contributing to it.

Next, there are all different kinds of ways people can become entangled with the Church and its members, networks, institutions, and programs that are not visible or even relatable to folks in different corners of the internet. The same is true of a variety of different organizations and institutions that many of us patronize or engage to one degree or another every day that contribute to harm, including Google, AT&T, Amazon, Chevron, NBC, and many others. There are a wide variety of circumstances that may make it incredibly difficult for individuals and families to avoid or to sever such entanglements. There are groups that provide resources and guidance for many of those folks, and that’s something I greatly appreciate, but some folks still may be in situations where leaving the country may be less of a sacrifice than leaving the Church. I’m not suggesting those are necessarily my circumstances, but what I’m trying to stress here is that people can be in all different kinds of circumstances that influence how they curate those entanglements, and I tend to find greater value in prioritizing harm reduction rather than binary purity tests for folks whose circumstances we just don’t know. The fact that someone chooses to continue to be an active participant in the Church is neither an endorsement of everything the Church does nor an indication they have not wrestled long and hard between the implications of those entanglements and what will be best for them and their families in their particular circumstances. If anyone thinks I have been flippant or dismissive of these concerns, or that I haven’t long given them—and continue to give them—long and serious thought, they don’t really know much about me at all.

The last thing I want to share has to do with my broader decision to remain an active member of the Church. The Church’s anti-LGBTQIA+ agenda has bothered me for more than 20 years, and in that time, I’ve tried my best to get better informed, to raise objections, and to spread awareness. This has brought me into direct personal contact with a wide variety of members, former members, and non-members who are queer, who are parents of queer kids and adults (living and dead), and who are LGBTQIA+ activists, artists, politicians, content creators, filmmakers, etc. I’ve been humbled by the courage, the strength, the thoughtfulness, and the compassion of these folks who have to live in a world they experience in a way that I never will. I’ve also been amazed by the diversity of their experiences and their ideas for the future. While I frequently hear former members talk about their own need to leave the Church for their safety, their peace of mind, or any one of a number of other reasons, I’ve been surprised by how many current members have told me they intend to stay not only because it is just as much their community as anyone else’s and they want to try to effect whatever change they are able to from the inside, but also because they want to provide safe spaces for others, and particularly queer youth, whether closeted or otherwise, who do not have an alternative community or as much agency regarding their activity in the Church.

I didn’t feel like that was my role for a long time, but I wanted to do my best to ensure I never made anyone else feel like I was not a safe person. As I have grown more outspoken within church settings about the harm facilitated by the Church, I’ve become aware of some folks around me who think of me as someone who will hold space for them. As one example, almost five years ago, after I started teaching Sunday school during the Old Testament year, I noticed a shift in who was attending the class. People I frequently didn’t see at church at all would be in my class (and some folks who were usually in class would now frequently have other places to be). I mentioned it to someone at one point, and they told me they were folks who normally didn’t feel comfortable or even safe in the classroom who wanted to attend on the days I was teaching and knew that it would be a safe space for them. I think about that from time to time, as well as a couple instances where folks have confided in me that I’ve helped them to overcome some their own prejudices. These are obviously not things I can share without coming across as having some kind of savior complex, and no doubt many are convinced that’s precisely my rhetorical goal, but the point really is to share experiences that I’ve had that lead me to feel like my activity and even my former employment in the Church have made things better for some of the people around me whose names and faces I know who are in the crosshairs of the Church’s oppressive heteronormativity and misogyny. That has been a factor in my decision to pay tithing: knowing that I can utilize my presence in the Church and my growing platform for the benefit of those inside and outside the institution.

Obviously, these considerations aren’t going to change how many people feel about my participation in the Church and my decision to tithe, and obviously there will be many for whom no circumstances could justify contributing to an organization like the LDS Church. Those concerns are certainly valid, and I don’t want to give the impression that I imagine my reasoning is above scrutiny or overrules anyone else’s experiences. I’m explaining those parts of my circumstances that I am willing to make public that are factors in my ongoing negotiation between my activity in the Church and my concerns for the wellbeing of vulnerable and underprivileged folks in my community and elsewhere in the world. Because tithing is an ongoing practice, so too will that process of negotiation be, and I don’t know what the outcome will be the next time around, though I can say for certain the concerns that have been expressed to me will continue to have a seat at the table alongside my own related concerns.

I will also continue—as a result of what my platform has afforded me—to contribute to those causes and movements that support vulnerable and underprivileged individuals on the local, national, and global level. Again, that obviously doesn’t excuse or cancel out harm done by the Church, but hopefully it can help folks understand a little better what goes into the calculus of my decision to tithe. As usual, I know there are many people out there with much more experience and knowledge than me on these issues, and I hope they will feel free to correct my mistakes or nuance or add to whatever is inadequately or awkwardly expressed here.

I have been reading about Brigham Young's practice of having the pioneers who travelled to Utah get rebaptized after they reached Salt Lake. Not a shelf-breaker for me, but why was there a need for this if the now Utah-based LDS church (and not any of the other groups that formed around other leaders at the time in Nauvoo) was the true church after the death of Joseph Smith and BY was his true successor? Apparently the reasoning was to renew their temple covenants?!? The official LDS church explanation today for this practice falls quite short. Seems like this practice was later dropped with an explanation that taking the sacrament accomplished that goal. Anyone else find this practice a little odd and not really taught about today in the church?

Both received revelations from angels and declared themselves prophets of God, both wrote new books of scripture, copied somewhat from the Bible, both because political leaders, both face similar opposition and started militias, both were into plural marriage. It just seems very similar to me.

I've thought about this a few times over the years. In the Mormon Fanfic BOM, the "evil" Zoramites go to a high wooden stand called a Rameumptom and give the same repetitive prayer about how they are blessed of god and the chosen people, etc. Its all about the evilness of pride and going through the motions etc.

How does the church not see the modern Rameumptoms in the church?

General Conference which is basically the same handful of topics just recycled year after year and all about the Mormons being the only ones with the truth and being the chosen people.

The temple being shoved in everyone's face wherever they go like we're better than everyone else but we really just do the exact same ceremony over and over again until everyone is bored out of their minds.

Honestly, even fast and testimony meeting feels a bit of the same where its either "I had such an amazing experience because I'm so faithful" or "My trauma is worse than yours so I'm going to be blessed."

The overbearing level of pridefulness is honestly disgusting in the church. I'm sure there are many more examples in the church, so feel free to give me some I haven't come up with yet.

By Annica Danielson (that’s me 😄)
Feeling quite proud of this one

What should I do? I’ve already said if they want to talk or ask questions about leaving, that I am here for them to talk, but idk if I need to do anything else. Any advice?

I'm 16 and I've been mormon my entire life thanks to being born into it, I hate it and I hate being forced into everything by my parents. I hate how everyone has tried to convince me that this religion is like my reason to live and that if I'm not apart of it that I'm a horrible person. I'm queer and my bsf is trans, and we both feel like we do not belong in the church (not to mention being alternative with bright dyed hair makes me feel even more like I don't belong) just because of the shade mormons give the LGBTQ community, I genuinely feel like everyone I'm forced to interact with is probably homophobic. I feel so much guilt knowing my brother is forcing "our" religion down people's throats (he's on a mission) and I can't do anything about it. Idk what point I'm trying to make here, just that I can't escape I guess and I'm just looking for some comfort or words of encouragement because everything is getting tiring

If you care : Hey, I was the girl who posted about how my mother traumatized me for masturbating and had to brave a cold night in the woods before my aunt had to step in. I also posted about how I was worried about my sister and if she would come back as a different person. I also made a "missionary rap" after a video my mom showed me as a response to it. I got in trouble for all of these saying that "I slandered my sister". Even though I don't remember mentioning her name or anything that screams " I hate my sister". I love my sister to death and was freaking out when some missionaries told me about the "missionary veil". Even my mom jokes that I took it too literally. I got in trouble for using crude language in my missionary rap and also for spilling my trauma because " it should stay inside the family". My other reddit account got deleted afterwards without my permission by my mother. I don't expect anyone to remember since it happened years ago. That's not even why I am posting.

Skip here:

My parents got a divorce and I am still living with them, my mom also works her ass off in the distribution center which is underpaid and understaffed. She just complains a lot about how her life is miserable and about work. She is also hypercritical and the constant negativity is starting to impact me. So is the fighting. All my friends from highschool have left for other colleges and church friends on missions. I keep telling myself that it will only be two more years in a community college then I can transfer to a four year school but I am starting to regret that choice. I want to be a scientist, maybe a biologist or someone who works with nuclear power plants. Something environmental. Going to church or even praying is starting to impact me a lot more than it used to. I start feeling a tightness in my chest when I do. I really want to remove my records but I just can't handle how everyone would react quite yet. It would be a rash decision right now. We also rely on church assistance and local food banks for support. On top of everything I am trying to lose weight and be healthier.

Just how in the world do you deal with this in a mormon environment, especially me suspecting that I am also autistic? How do I navigate a

Conversations with people who are immature or won't listen to you and assume you are wrong no matter what? What advice are you allowed to give me?

For added context

Mom is a trump supporter, antivaxx ( most likely), is into chiropractic stuff and might not even get me tested for autism since I am now an adult so " what would a diagnosis even do?"

How do you have a relationship with someone so different from you?

I will be deleting this within a couple of hours , y'all have until 6:30

Do you believe many TBMs have little or no boundaries when it comes to respecting others’ privacy?

I’ve been listening to John Dehlin’s Joseph Smith podcast (sorry John, I haven’t donated yet but will) and they mentioned the Mormon History Association. It piqued my interest and seems something up my alley. However, I’m trying to make sure it’s actually scholarship based rather than a bunch of members with faith promoting stories about their pioneer ancestors. Anyone know anything? Thanks in advance.

I’m completely, irrevocably, & irrecoverably Ex-Mormon. I did attend the Provo Gulag for a few semesters back in the day before I transferred out (a mutual agreement with HCO and others, but that’s another story), yet 40+ years later, I’m still a BYU Football fan. I date back to the Gifford Nielsen/Mark Wilson era.

In my very amateur opinion, Kalani Sitake is a great “players” coach, Bear Bachmeier is outrageously fun to watch, and the defense is arguably the best they’ve fielded in quite awhile.

Anyway, all that being said, am I the only one who thinks the Cougs - as well as they are playing - are just a “wee bit” overrated at #2 this week? That’s an extremely optimistic ranking, IMO. Change my mind…😁

DISLCAIMER that i am not saying that them doing their calling and asking 12 year olds about their sex life and shit is good. Please don't assume I'm saying that.

I remember when I was super mormon, really liking my bishop. he was a really sweet older man and he gave out candy and genuinely seemed like such a nice guy, and now that I'm out and I don't instinctively trust bishops anymore I'm starting to wonder how much of that was real and how much of it was culty "the bishop is someone you should like" stuff getting in my head. I'm having a hard time fully coming to terms with the fact that some of the things he did might have been bad or malicious and its hard since he was always so kind to me. I like to think he was genuinely just a good person in the wrong path in life who ended up in a cult, but idk. Is that even possible, being a bishop for years, without an inkling of how fucked up things are??

Long story short I met with missionairies in person (I am not a mormon nor am I ex-mormon) cause I was enjoying messing with them over text and on the phone. I was kind of just letting them babble on about scripture and what not and when they got to explaining the kingdoms to me I started thinking. "Why would anyone who isnt born into this wanna join?" If you don't do all the church shit and just live your life you still go to heaven in their belief system. Why would I wanna join this church and go to a heaven without any of my current friends and family who wouldnt convert even if I did. The terrestrial or telestial kingdoms sound like the place i'd wanna go anyways. Honestly meeting with missionairies somehow made me wanna be a mormon even less than I already did which wasnt much at all.

I'm probably gonna continue meeting up with them cause ive heard missionairies are pretty isolated so I can be someone for them to just talk to for a bit about things that arent entirely LDS related since we are similar age and can get along well.

Okay don’t downvote, hear me out! I’m going as Sister Paxton from Heretic for Halloween and I’m wondering where I can grab a Book of Mormon to use as a prop for little to no cost without getting it through the official church.