r/TheOrville • u/Old_Boss8237 • 10h ago
Other Charly Burke
SPOILERS AHEAD!!
I THINK this is a semi-hot take in this fanbase, but I loved Charly’s character. I didn’t like the way the show handled her arc, and I’d like to hear some opinions on this and have a discussion.
This is going to be insanely long, unfortunately 😭 I’ll try to break it up into paragraphs as I go, but I am autistic and have hyperfixated on this show for a few months now. There is a summary below, for those of you without the time to read through it all.
As a lesbian, it is ALWAYS exciting to see other queer women on screen. This might just be me, but ESPECIALLY in universes where it’s as widely accepted as in the Orville. But had Charly not even had feelings for her in the first place, I can still see her reacting the way she did to Amanda’s death the same having just lost a best friend in such a traumatic way. I know, personally, if my best friend had been killed as a show of force by an army incapable of empathy looking to commit straight up genocide, I would’ve reacted much worse.
As a matter fact, that might be the one flaw I have with her character motivation. She wasn’t as angry as you’d expect someone whose best friend was murdered by someone she has to see every single day to be.
To be completely honest, as the situation is with a lot of shows, most of the female main cast feels very one-dimensional, or written as stereotypes and only later on given some depth.
When we first meet Commander Grayson, for example, she’s introduced first-thing as a cheating wife. The audience briefly sees her as a villain, with no hint of reasoning to her abhorrent actions. Later on, we see Grayson show genuine remorse and sympathy for what she’d done, even being the one to get Mercer his position on the Orville in the first place. We know there’s romantic tensions between Grayson and Mercer from the first few episodes, and from a female perspective, or at least mine, it feels a bit like her “role” in the show is to eventually end up with Mercer. We also find out later on, that, surprise, she was sexually assaulted (Because knowingly dosing someone with pheromones so that they’ll sleep with you is ABSOLUTELY assault, even though it isn’t treated that way in the show) by the man she cheated on Mercer with.
I have numerous problems with this storyline that I could write a whole other essay on. It diminishes any reasoning she previously held for what she’d done, whilst grappling with it. The weight of forgiveness is slim to none when the perpetrator of the offence turns out to have actually been guilt-free. Not only that, but handling what was blatantly SA (Because again, drugging someone so they’ll have intercourse with you is deplorable) in a way that portrays it as simply a plot twist and not taking the time to write out how Grayson manages that kind of realisation while playing it off as if the dude is just generally scummy rather than the rapist that he is, sends a kind of a message I really didn’t want to see from this show. It feels like this storyline was a change made so that there would be no reason to dislike Commander Grayson, whilst other masculine characters like Issac are allowed to make morally bankrupt choices lead by insecurity, anger, jealousy, a dogmatic or programmed mindset and be forgiven for them later. It feels like the writers knew it’d be harder to sympathise with emotionally complex women and wrote Grayson based off what would make her appeal most to a male audience.
With Claire and Issac, I would’ve loved to see more insight into her past, her previous marriage, or at least some more conversation about what her life on earth was like before the Orville. I did think the friendship she had with Alara (Who I will yap about in a moment) was very well written, and I wish we’d seen more of it rather than the some of the tension between her and Issac. Again, this could very well just be me, but it feels as though Claire had so much potential to be a such a powerful character with depth, female friendships, and an unconventional relationship, yet the writers chose to boil her down to the woman in love with a robot. This is just a theory on my end, but to me, Claire’s relationship with Issac felt forced. Forced as in, the audience got bored of a struggling single mom (Which were actually comments I would see on the show, by the way) and both had to give her a husband to give her any kind of importance in the plot, and to brainstorm a way to introduce sympathy for Issac.
Alara was one of my absolute favourite characters first getting into the show. It’s rare to see a strong female character in media with a male protagonist, that DOESN’T eventually wind up giving that up to settle down into a relationship. She remains the strongest of the main cast until the day she leaves, and the commentary on her being so young in a position so important having no impact on that strength is powerful. We even get to see her home planet, her family, THEIR dynamics, her sister and their conversation with each other. However, it feels like her character was boiled down to just her strength, and the fact that it’s societally considered unconventional for HER to have it. The issue of Xalayans (I apologise if I haven’t spelled it right, and please correct me if I’m wrong) not being fond of military wasn’t brought up before the episode in which she had to leave, and before that, every conflict with Alara had to do with her strength and position. To me, what this says is the writers didn’t know how to write women without giving them an archetype. One, singular problem in their life they have to battle with. They weren’t given the same complexity as male characters.
What I’m trying to say with all this is that Charly Burke’s character felt like a breath of fresh air. She took the trauma she experienced and reacted to it in the only way she knew how, with absolutely zero support from anyone around her. She didn’t blindly accept that Issac was “good” now, simply because he was a part of the main cast, and hated him for the atrocities he’d committed. It made her feel incredibly realistic, and like there was much more to her than a single role in the progression of male protagonists. It’s also worth noting that, Issac only turned on his kind because he’d personally grown attached to Claire and her kids. It’s not like he grew a heart, and thought to himself “Maybe humanity deserves to live, this isn’t right”. Killing Ty would have personally hurt him. Charly has every right in the book to hate Issac and the Kaylon army.
My issue with her arc is that it sends a very clear message of “Forgive your oppressors because they’re in the main cast”. Forgiveness is not something that should be treated as a necessity. That should have been her choice. I get the argument about Issac being in an important position aboard the Orville, but he took his OWN life. That was his choice, and his alone. If the only person that can save him in the immediate proximity will not preform a procedure because not only did he kill himself, but also killed someone very close to her, in my opinion, it should be considered horrible that Mercer continued ordering her, and even wound up relieving her of duty for it. Burke held a crucial role as the only member aboard who could visualise in 4d - If anyone was being unprofessional here, Mercer made a decision based off emotional bias towards Issac, and a decision that, had Charly gone home, would have eventually wound up killing the entire Kaylon army.
It’s worse that the rest of the main cast treats her as some sort of self-absorbed villain playing the victim card. The show took her trauma seriously, the cast didn’t. The “Monopoly over grief” quote was insane considering this woman lost everyone on her ship, and was essentially told to get over it and directly help their killer. Imagine how traumatic having to heal him must have been, especially with survivors guilt.
Her arc was played out in a way that punished her for feeling angry. If Issac had done anything to right the wrongs of his actions rather than attempt to kill himself or try “human socialisation” with Burke over time, I could understand it. Hell, if any cast members had shown her a sliver of empathy instead of lecturing her for expressing trauma, I could understand it. Instead, trauma-induced anger was treated as something to just get over. To suck it up. That forgiveness is something you HAVE to give, and to listen to the people who hurt you, to help them when needed regardless of what they’ve done. That is the message her arc, which had HUGE potential to be possibly the most well written of her series, sent.
Summary: I think the hate on Charly shouldn’t be on her as a character. I think it’s hard for the audience of the Orville to sympathise with complex female characters the same way they’d sympathise with a character like Issac, and the criticism should be directed towards how her arc was handled and the “Suck up trauma-induced anger as you have to forgive the perpetrators eventually” message behind it, rather than her arguably realistic reactions to grief.
Edit: Btw, I’m trying to reply to all comments, so I apologise if I take a minute to respond 😭 I really do appreciate people taking the time to leave their opinions, this is a discussion that really needs to be had <33
